Don’t Hang Them
Verna St Rose-Greaves, who has been named Special Advisor on Children’s Affairs to Prime Minister Kamla Persasd-Bissessar, is against the People’s Partnership’s current moves to return to the hangman, saying she will not compromise on her views that capital and corporal punishment have no place in a civilised society.
…Verna: I will walk if hangings resume
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July 18, 2010
Martin Daly: The fallacy about hanging
This week I write about implementation of the death penalty. I seek to infuse recent extempo utterances on that subject with a stiff dose of legal reality.
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To Hang or Not?
Newsday Editorial
July 07, 2010 – newsday.co.tt
MINISTER of Works, Jack Warner, has placed the question of the death penalty back on to the public agenda, with his remarks on Monday that he has advised Attorney General Anand Ramlogan, to work towards resuming hangings in this country. He told reporters, “As Acting Prime Minister, I want to tell you that on Thursday at Cabinet meeting, we will sit down and discuss ways and means of starting back hangings.”
Warner said that the mere passage of new laws by the Government would not deter criminals if there is a lack of political will to enforce the death penalty as meted out by the law courts. He noted there have been 265 murders so far this year, which we note is only half-way through.
The 120-Day Plan of the People’s Partnership Manifesto in the recent general election had vowed, as item 11, to initiate an anti-crime plan to cut the country’s high murder rate, with the first phase of the plan running from June to December.
To add to the Government’s urgency is the need to be seen to be hitting the ground running, especially in view of the impending July 26 Local Government Election a mere two months after the general election.
Mr Warner’s remarks may well re-ignite debate on a contentious issue in which both sides of the fence have sincerely-held views. Does the death penalty deter future homicides, and even if not, is it justifiable under the old adage of an eye for an eye? Or is this nation best served by adopting the values of first world countries (presumably to which this country aspires to emulate) most of which have abolished the death penalty?
Full Article : newsday.co.tt
HANG MAN It is a good idea, yes bring it back
no hanging will not be a good idea
The issue of the death penalty must surface!!Criminals are not stupid!!They perform well calculated acts of atrocity on innocent victims!!I commend Jack Warner & fully support this as one of the many variables that can reduce crime in our society!The Judiciary must be given all the support to have cases tried & sentences handed out as fast as possible!
Hanging people should not be deemed as the only approach to stopping crime. However, it should be viewed as part of the justice system. The only reasonable approach for stopping runnaway crime is to tackle the problem at the heart. It is a known fact that criminals comprise a very small part of society. When they kill and are not caught, they continue to kill. My view is that there are serial killers in T&T who will continue to kill regardless of any law. Their thirst for innocent blood is insatiable. An efficient police system is desperately needed. Solving crime is the only true approach to stopping criminality in T&T. The solve ratio for crime is abysmally low in T&T. The police force is thoroughly demotivated.
My cousin is a police officer and he says sometimes he is in a situation breaking up a fight or something. He calls for back up and 2 1/2 hours later the backup arrives. He says there is simply too vast an area and too little officers and equipment to effectively deal with criminals. He is considering an early retirement.
In New York my brother step daughter is a police officer. She says if a police officer call for back up they are there within minutes. The place is crawling with officers. Further officers are given a high level of respect, if they go to the dentist or doctor they are automatically place in front of the line. The public appreciates the work that these officers do.
What is need in Trinidad is a strong strategic approach to policing. Panday had the right idea when he formed rapid response. Heavily armed police swarm an area, they are sending a message to criminals. Maybe this should be revisited, also stiffer penalities for illegal hand gun owners, along with a swifter justice system, and more cops. Better recruiting methods that seek to eliminate candidates who may have used drugs, have association with drug dealers. Detectives must investigate each candidate prior to approval for policing. And finally officer who are drunk on the job should be immediately fired. A civil complaints commission with some teeth need to set down stiff guidelines to get rid of the dirty cops. After all the biggest help for the police is the public…A public that trust officers, not one that views them with suspicion.
No one with any semblance of intelligence cares seriously about this new distraction that is put forth again by the real PP leader, and ‘PM in waiting,’ as even the guys that did not graduate beyond kindergardan/ grade school,all knows fully well that the death penalty has absolutely no impact on crimes.
The PM claimed in her virgin address to gullible, money seeking , CARICOM heads , to be concerned about curbing regional crimes. To prove this therefore perhaps ,she should start serious discussions with regional counterparts as to finding a way to develop some coordination , and sensible strategies for so doing, beyond employing white foreigners.
Part of this should of necessity decide if the Privy Council should be finally eradicated ,for the expensive ,and unused Caribbean Court of Appeal, headquartered in our country.
Ain’t it grand that these comedians when out of power ,love to pontificate how much they admire the foreign -chiefly white -folks of the world, and their progressive ways, where most have done away with the barbaric death penalty, but now in power ? Nada!
Here is a chance to follow the lead , and develop some cohones Mr tactic PM Jack, and your female counterpart. Phonies!Tough on chiefly poor ,low caste blue color criminals, but soft on crime when it comes to white color crooks and bandits , for fear apparently that it might hit too close to home, yes?
It is getting less feasible to still love this country . Can any say where I can get a copy of national ingrate, V.S. Naipaul’s best selling book ,entitled, ‘How to be an insecure , self hater ,who despise your country ,and people , yet live to tell?’
“Here is a chance to follow the lead , and develop some cohones Mr tactic PM Jack, and your female counterpart. Phonies” The real phonies Neal are out of office. Please let your brain guide you and not your tribalistic DNA.
I support the Death Penalty, but if the criminals begin to commit murder suicides, then what?
Countries without the death penalty have lower rates of murder than those with it.
For example, Canada, Sweden, France, etc., have rates of murder much lower than does the US.
In fact, inside the US, states that do not have the death penaly, for example, West Virginia, Michigan, etc (see attached website) have lower murder rates than do states with the death penalty, for example, Alabama, Mississippi.
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/node/657
The reason for this is in Canada for instance they don’t have the right to bear arms as in the U.S. so the comparisson is skewered in favour of Canada and Nordic nations. Also in Canada as in the U.S. the police response is quick and overwhelming. Criminals know that they will be staring down the barrel of a gun if they misbehave. The death penalty in the US is a necessary response to liberal gun laws. Comparing state with state and saying it so because…. is wrong. Perhaps the enforcement factor is stronger in states without the death penalty….The point is that there are many variables.
Given the overwhelming amount of evidence, academic and empirical which show that implementing Capital Punishment has no deterrent impact on homicides in particular and crime in general, any debate on the causal relations between the two, is as credible as a debate on the viability of The Flat Earth Theory.
In fact, what has been shown is that cxrime is either reduced or increased in societies to the extent that ordinary, law-abiding citizens have reason either to hold public institutions and officials in regard or in disregard.
In short, it is not criminals who cause increases in crime, but those, for example, politicians, judges, lawyers, police and prison officers, who carry status and abuse it, acting above the law who begin what the copy-cat criminal elements complete.
It is a hard fact to accept, especially in contexts where those who advocate implementation of Capital Punishment, etc, might also have interests in privatizing prison systems.
Capital punishment should NOT be viewed as a deterrent. As I have said before the serial killers, hired guns in T&T do not care about being hanged. That is why it should be done. But only for extreme cases where the murder is such that the only reasonable response is the hang man.
I have no issue with the resumsion of hanging. But of what use is all the talk about resuming it if our laws are weak, detection is weak and conviction is weak, who are we going to hang. So I may agree with Neal when he says that this is but a distraction, not sure from what, but I can agree.
“Hanging never left us” Basdeo PAnday to the BBC some time before the Chadee Nine were executed all weekend long. And this was supposed to curb crime? Ask Gov. George Bush of Texas ,later president. His state won international ignominy for 40 executions in one year, that did not curb crime.
The people with the “bounce me nah” mentality are the same ones who say “Ah ready to dead”. Executions by the state, are judicial murders, and this is why intelligent,enlightened states like those in Europe have abandonned the death penalty.
“Vengeance is Mine” sayeth the Lord of Hosts, and the Bible is full of that vengeance in the Middle East, which has now known 4000 years of war, and death without end.
Putting a criminal to death puts a price on the heads of the judges, prison officers and others. No one knows who the hangman is, because it is a dark and dirty thing he/she is doing.
All of the countries that still use the death penalty have higher rates of murder than those who do not.Do the research. It is because of the minimal value placed on human life in those places. Some Eastern countries, from Pakistan to Singapore also whip adults. They behead in Saudi Arabia, but murders are still committed, usually for money- immigrant workers who are not paid, businessment not wanting to pay employees. etc.
Hanging belongs in the dark ages, as does drawn and quartering, hanging beheaded heads from Tower Bridge, and the most barbaric of all, the Roman tendency to crucify at the side of the road and leave the body there until it fell apart, forbidding the relatives to collect the bones. They allowed Christ to be taken down off the cross because the knew he was special. It was not the norm.
Rome fell nonetheless, as did all the empires built on public executions and wars.
People, we do not want to go there.WE do nto want this as a legacy of the “One Love” goernment.
How could we rant and rave about a woman’s decision to abort a child, and also approve of hangings by the staate? Madness. Jack Warner must examine his soul, if he still has one.If he too, made a “pact with the devil” to get power, then he may have promised that being some souls. I hope not. He sounds so Panday.God help us!
Putting a criminal to death puts a price on the heads of the judges, prison officers and others. No one knows who the hangman is, because it is a dark and dirty thing he/she is doing.–Linda.
I disagree with that idea that executing someone is putting some price on someone head. That is a silly conclusion. When a person commits murder they forfeit the right to life. Their blood is on their own head. If they are executed then natural justice is being observed. The government bears the sword therefore they have the right to use that sword to ensure law and order is maintained in society.
However, the murder laws have to be changed. The judge and jury must take into account (1) circumstances surrounding the murder, (2) influence in the psychological make-up of the murderer (eg. provocation, drug abuse, history of physical abuse etc). (3) pre-meditated murder. For pre-meditated murder the one who is actually planning or executing the murder should die by lethal injection or hanging. There should not be a host of people being executed for one murder. Dole Chadee alone should have been hang for those murders. He was the chief instigator. Why? Because there is the controller and the controlled. The controller uses threats,money, beatings, and psychological abuse to motivate and control the “controlled”. All of these things must be taken into account if justice is to be truly served.
As for Jack Warner making a pact with the devil I think the idea of the hangman is nothing new, in fact Mr. Manning said he would consider it’s reintroduction when he was in power.
My view is that hanging or lethal injection should only be used when it is determined that the person who committed the crime (1) Planned and executed this deliberately, (2) showed no remorse, (3) killed others, (4) Cause unnecessary aggregious suffering to the victim, (5) have a history of criminal behaviour.
Case in point of a stupid murder law. Two brothers in Sando killed a known druggie who came into their home. The law response was to sentence both men (who have wife and children) to death. I was horrified upon reading that judgement. To this day I think they are still in jail. The law in this instance is vengeful rather than justice oriented. The law must ensure that the scales of justice is balanced. Sometimes it does not.
The law should taken into consideration the age of the druggie, the possiblity that he could have been killed earlier rather than later for his habit, the fact that these men were defending their home. All of that should have produce a sentence of 5 years each, making a combined total of 10 years for the death of this druggie. Would the druggie have survived 10 years on the planet??? Probably not, but it is a fair sentencing.
These cases should be reviewed and the laws change to ensure that it is dispensing justice rather than vengence. After all vengence is mines saith the Lord I will repay. The law needs to updated regarding murder in T&T. It should be discussed and debated at law school the merits of each case such as the one I mentioned, so that justice is truly served.
By the same token, the presidents, monarchs and rulers of all warring countries lives should be forfeit, because there never really is a justification for war, except old men’s greed for other people’s lad, wealth and women, and you can include women in the wealth.This is why rpin and pillaging is part of war.Destroy the man, his lnds, his liing, his genepool, and penetrate his women with your sperm.
Who ever identifies himself as “the hangman” Do you think he is proud of that job?If when you take a life, yours is forfeit, so too is the life of those who pass sentence/judgment on a suposed murderer, as judges in all systems do. Somethims despite evidence ro the contrary.
Each man will give an account for his action. And some of these despots should be executed pronto.
The debate of whether to hang or not to hang is really dumbing down the issue.It’s not simply an “either” “or”.
We should be asking instead : what’s the root cause of this extreme, violent, anti-social behaviour? Is it environment ie poverty? A lack of education? Ethnicity? The manner in which some people are socialised ie brought up?
Which geographical areas in TnT produce the most murderers?It seems to me that over the last fifty years the name Laventille keeps cropping up. Is this a base canard on the people of that area? Has any UWI researchers tried to come up with some answers?
An enlightened and progressive society , through its various institutions, is continuously looking for answers to these troubling questions.
Mentone
So what is to be done with criminals who abuse the system? Granted there might be in death row people who are innocently convicted. Are we going to be bleeding hearts and say “We convict them but we feel reluctant to hang them because God will punish us?” Listen, if the law states that that offence is punishable by death and the highest court in the land upholds a guilty verdict, then we all know what to do.
a lot of barbaric criminals are taking advantage of the system to kill people because they know they will be cared for in jail with taxpayers’ money for the remainder of their lives. And another thing is that when a prisoner who should have been hanged keeps languishing in jail, the entire family is continually hard put to go to visit, to continually be traumatised every time that they have to visit. The family also have to go through this lifelong stress. So I say be done with it. Uphold the law to the last letter.
Look at how these beasts have started back to kidnap innocent children. By the way, have the wonderful police solved any kidnapping cases that anybody knows of?
Any, until such time as the law changes or is ammended, then please carry out the law. this is my view.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jose-ramoshorta/an-appeal-for-sakineh-moh_b_639177.html
Think folks how much happier someone like linda bennet would be if we too were elevated to a Abu Bakr Muslim country , with laws such as these to enforce. Sorry, this does not count , for Iranians are Shiites, and are less civilize than their global Sunni brothers ,and sisters. Madam L , you are better than me on these intricate matters, explain again what was meant by a “noble savage,”and just curious ,is that characterization,only applicable to males?
What is to be done with Ish, Steve, Carlos and Bas? In some countries, they execute for fraud against the people. What we need to do is tackle the root causes of crime, the inequities in the society, where the poor are stuck at the bottom, with no hope of ever getting a leg up, no matter how hard they work. If I work fifty hours a week, spend three to four hours a day getting to and from work, and only get to be a parent to my children on weekends, its easy for my children to go astray.
Crime then beomes the means to the end they are denied by unemployment, in a society where the rich get richer by the minute, and the poor are less and less able to feed their children.
These inequities are not the fault of the party now in power. They have always been there, and we the people have accepted that they would be there, as long as we were making it, we did not care.The maid in you house does not make enough to live on, no matter how hard she works, no matter how skilled an ironer she is. The grass cutter at the side of the road may be the hardest working person in the land, but he is still poor. These are the people who turn to crime, because they can see no other way out.A policeman at the bottom of the ranks, no matter how hard he works,will tend to stay there. There is no progress chart by which he can move up the ladder, no set of courses that he would be encouraged to take to move ahead.Put such a person in a North American setting, and despite racism and other roadblocks, that person can rise up in the ranks.
The cost of any appliance in TnT is more than a month’s salary for an average worker. These are the things that lead to crime. Greedy profiteers suck the poor man dry; and the poor man only has his wits to help him get ahead. Anything you could steal and sell, is pure profit. Any drugs you sneak in, is pure profit.
Hoest people finish dead last. I know. I am one of them, but I am content to sleep soundly in my bed.
The young people of today see no positive end to all their hard work.
Maybe hanging would reduce the population, but believe me, its not a solution to what ails us.More employment opportunities, fair and liveble wages, and the just treatment of all before the law, these are places where we could start.When the system sets wealthy criminals free and tries to nail the poor man to the cross, the poor man gets out his illegal gun, or his cutlass.plain talk.
What is to be done with Ish, Steve, Carlos and Bas? In some countries, they execute for fraud against the people. –Linda.
Linda are you advocating executing people for fraud? Then Mr. Manning would be heading that list, along with his cronies. I think Manning should be executed though, as an example to future leaders who waste the money. He should be executed in the Toruba stadium where citizens could pay to see this event. The money collect could then be used to complete the stadium without futher cost to the citizenry.
Noble Savage was the European’s designation of those African people they met, who did not immediately shoot them with blow guns and such. It assumes that the “beast” before me can be trained, but does not think independently. Use that as a rubric to analyse Caribbean society, and the white assumptions of non-white behaviour. If we were kind it was the Noble Savage part of us coming to the fore, but the “Savage” was always there.
Do you remember the case of the four year old boy who fell into the gorilla pit at the San Diego Zoo about ten years ago? The father gorilla, realizing that the child was hurt, and was his cousin, gently pcked him up and brought him to the gates, put him down and backed off so that zoo officials could open the gates and rush the child to the emergency room. Tht gorilla was acting like what the European thought a Noble Savage should act like. In fact, it revealed to us how human they really were. It helped change the way people relate to gorillas. On an occasion when my brother-in-law and his friends, avid yachtsmen, were adrift on a race from Trinidad to Grenada, and were beginning to despair, a school of dolphins came alongside and stayed with them until help came. Later, when my brother in law died, and was cremated, and his ashes were being rowed out into the Gulf of Paria, a school of dolphins appeared and escoted his two boats. My sister in law, and the guys who were adrift with him, swore they were the same dolphins. The event was carried in Newsday, in 2002 or so. These animal behaviours have elevated them to the level of humans, and so, the “noble savage ” idea belongs now, in the dustbin of history. If there was such a trait, I would imagine it would occur in females also,unless it was something cultivated, and not innate.The Idiot of Itard was considered a Noble Savage.Hope this helps.
One of the first comments made by the new Canadian police commissioner is that the police should be fairly compensated because they have families to support and expenses to pay. He commented that if people are paid properly and can afford to cope with the cost of living, it is unlikely that they would resort to illegal means.
You do have some courage Ms L to even suggest that crime cuts across racial, and class lines , when you highlighted these three white color crooks.
The distortion advocates, would prefer to hear that crimes in our country should be limited to one sector of the country, and the only solution lies in finding a foreign savior, utilizing draconian measures ,such as the death penalty, chiefly against the poor, and feudalistic thinking that only the government has the responsibility to fully solve the problem.
Where exactly are the socially responsible entrepreneurs, and hugely successful members of the business community in our country , along with their global conglomerate pals?
People were making similar comments and worse about Mr Manning when he was the Prime Minister. It would seem that the policy that is in place for the PP is to treat them like teflon.
EDucation, meaningful work and a living wage are the solutions to crime. Slave/indenture societies are unwilling to lift their poor. They need them at the bottom to take advantage of.We pontificate all sorts of nonsense in this area, but there you have it. Education, Jobs and a chance to participate meaningfully in the society is what it will take.
If all the young people I know who have been taken advantage of by their employers, used a gun or a cutlass to re-equalize things, the crime rate would rise 100%. We still have that “gwan”mentality. Chase the employee off, without paying him or her. When they resort to the justice they know, they are branded criminals. The cause of their crime goes scott free.
EDucation, meaningful work and a living wage are the solutions to crime. –Linda. I would differ on that statement because T&T have a good education system, lots of money and the poor are being helped with old age pension increase, CEPEP, OJT, HYPE and other programs. The end of crime is the restoration of the family. The baccanalian culture is slowly destroying T&T. I notice some of my innocent niece whinning with young boys on their behind (sorry to be this graphic). The songs are passed off as arts and culture but is loaded with sexual innuendos. The result of all of this is the fatherless homes. Prime target for gangs and wickedness.
I grew up in abject poverty, I had one pants and shirt that I faithfully washed and used as often as was necessary. I did not for one moment thought about stealing from anyone. I had both parents and they instill a set of strong values in me. Today the fatherless home is the singular prime cause of criminality. The home needs to protected from excessess of culture and baccanalia. The first thing that needs to be done is a celebration of marriage and respect for the boundaries of marriage. Too many married couples are looking for love outside the home. That is wrong. There has not been any real research into criminal behaviour maybe it is in the DNA of some people…
Start hanging 200 criminals a week. Do that for 52 weeks then re-assess the crime ststus. Only one good way to find out it works.
And for those thinking about commiting crime, think again.
Thank you Madam L for that thorough explanation as requested. Well,that perhaps means that cousin linda bennet is off the hook.
Apologies cousin linda bennet, on second thought you are correct, and help build a good case that “a lot of barbaric criminals are taking advantage of the system to kill people because they know they will be cared for in jail.”
What were we idiots thinking, out here in the non criminal world, such that we could not figure that one out?
You further aced it by wisely adding , “the family also have to go through this lifelong stress. So I say …..uphold the law……….these beasts have started back to kidnap innocent children…have the wonderful police solved any kidnapping cases that anybody knows of?”
Imagine the 10,000 or so kids that were murdered by dads throughout the decades , after their moms were also eliminated ,in certain unmentionable enclaves across our land. How about the, cell phone using , drunkards -some with unbuckled kids -that drive on the roads like they were unrepentant , top notched racers on the highway , like Frankie Boodrams once famously did to win successive races in Waller Field?
So tell me , how do you encourage an unmotivated , and demoralized Police Officer , living in Never Dirty Morvant , Upper Lavantille Febeau , or Erin ,to do his job linda bennet, by putting a Canadian in charge of him?
How exactly does Mr Gibbs do a better job to get the Chickland , or Los Bajos resident ,to come forward and give evidence after fearing for his, or her life ,and that of family? With your much adored British Privy Council in place , do you know how many years it takes to finally get someone through the hang man noose, and the cost both for the state , and sometimes financially strapped individual?
You do not only want just for the financially endowed ,as opposed to the poor , do you linda bennet?
Let me see you ran out of the country perhaps in 1986 , just like many , but have no conception as to how many well trained police officers, have abandoned their jobs for greener pastures since 1990, but have no compunction in remaining silent , as opposed to demanding justice for the 100 or more that died in our country , whose spirits are crying out for closure , as no enquiries are forthcoming?
What’s that, Manning’s well publicized Church scam takes precedence? I got you! Once more I humbly enquire , with citizens like these , who needs enemies, ehh folks ?
Let’s wish our people well.
Did you hear of the “businessman” in China who used ethelyne glycol(radiator fuel) in toothpaste and soaps, instead of glycerine? Many children in poor countries like Panama died. Well he was executed by the government of China. That sort of Death Penalty deterent would probably work in TnT, for those who pik up rotten meat from the LA Bsse, wash it, dye it and sell it to the poor.
As it is, the ONLY well to do person EVER executed in TnT was Dr.DAlip Singh, for carving up his Swedish wife and dumping her in the Gulf.That was more than fifty years ago. There has emerged since a “Don’t touch he nuh. He connected” culture since.
Our death penalty laws fall very hard on the same people who were and have been continuously brutalized by the system. Every manager, in private companies and the public service needs to learn how to treat people like humans. This would help reduce crime. Our “big boys” are sacrosanct. None of you are probably old enough to remember when Dennis Solomon’s father sprung the young miscreant from jail. His father was Deputy Prime Minister in the First Williams government, I think. This set the standard of who should be arrested, and who should go free on a technicality. The jails are full of poor people, who are there because they are poor. As long as we do not even attempt to adjust the inequities of the society, crime will continue. According to a young man I am trying to keep on the straight and narrow, there are two languages Trinis understand. Cuss and violent threats.He says the latter is an international language. When a man is staring down the barrel of a gun, he understands your position completely. Must it come to this, over and over? Will the guns stop coming in from Venezuela along with the drugs from Columbia? Unless we make bribery and corruption hangable offences, we spinning top in mud.
http://guardian.co.tt/news/crime/2010/07/09/killer-escapes-hangman
Madam L , seems as if dey just made your case, re this result, huh? Do we the socially conscious ,seriously think some poor boozo from Mt Dor Rd. Champ Fleurs , or ‘cut tail, poor man haven Caranege,’ can go under the bed, to get $US900,500 to stage a high end defense such as this, with Settahal in the lead?
Hey LTC Helon Demogal, and uncaring ,fellow pro death penalty advocate linda bennet, we just ain’t ready to break dem necks as yet ,got to save Basdeo first , my friends.
Remember he too was a victim of neo racist, black ,over zealous, pro genocidal police, and DPP officials, yes? Now you see why the barbaric death penalty system ,must be left in the closet where it belongs, as human beings should not be allowed to take lives, either through senseless wars, state murders, terrorism, abortions, and selective mercy killings by neo tribal doctors.
Most importantly,the financially privileged, should not be allowed to have an edge on low cast folks at the bottom of the socio economic ladder.
Let’s now make an effort for authentic , level playing field justice ,as proclaimed by our new AG, and Minister of Justice, hummmm?
An eye for an eye has not worked to keep crime and murders down. I see it as saying it is okay to kill if the government does it. I also think that there are international Human Rights bodies that Trinidad and Tobago are a part of and this puts pressure on the Government to desist from hangings.
I remember what it felt like when the last set of hangings took place. The country felt like a meat shop.
I also see a connection between stopping corporal punishment in schools and hanging. The way it looks to me is that we are now setting up our children to believe that they have rights and the hand of of law would not physically harm them but as soon as they rich a legal age and commit the crime they pay with their lives.
Do you not think that something is wrong here?
Some of us also believe that the lives of all sentient beings are sacred , and so we human beings should avoid all forms of killing even for food Ludger. Just being provocative my friend , as I suspect that you love your Gerra pork, Jamaican Jerk Chicken, black pudden,curry duck , peleau , and oxtail.
I agree with you that life is sacred but the hunt and kill is also normal however the kill for the kill is not.
Depends on whether you are talking lion or tiger. Lions kill to eat, and will only kill when hungry. The rest of the time food- impalas and others could graze in peace.
The tiger kills to expand his territory and does not eat all he kills. He kills for the sheer joy of the hunt.
Are trinis lions or tigers?
Neither ,Madame L, for any country that claim to be striving to a regional and global leader, that has a white Canadian as their Commissioner of Police , and a white final court of appeal,cannot be talk about in the same breath as lions , or tigers.That is more the ways of herd-like sheep, mimics , and zandolees ,looking for some hole to hide . We just ain’t ready for prime time , can never stand on our own feet. I beg your pardon, we were referring to meat.
Sing Maestro, another my heros of the much ignored , and maligned ,’Black Socrates Movement.’
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZnKHe3BL1E&feature=related
I think that hanging should be brought back. It would not completely eradicate the problem but it would be a deterrent to a great extent to potential criminals. If I wanted to commit a crime and knew the consequences I would be faced with (hanging), I would think again because no one wants to die.
The victims are crying out for justice for their innocent lives that were taken.
Eileen, you are missing the point. You would fear hanging, the criminals won’t. You know armies are very good at recruiting young hotheads who are not afraid to die? They just want to take some company with them? THAT is the basis of all wars. Bravado ends in death, ad war without end. When thoe same poeple come home from the wars,the often killtheir wives, and their friends fear them. They are of no use to society.Look at the criminals all over the world the same way. I would never dream of taking a life, because of my deep seated beliefs that only God can create life, and he alone should take it back. The blood of all hanged people(lethal injection, firing squad, beheaded people) hang over the state like a mantle of death, blood asking for more blood. It never ends.
This is why countries with no death penalty have lower murder rates. Our murders escalated since the Chadee Nine were executed in one weekend of 1999. Included in the nine was one who could have been cleared on appeal. His blood hangs over u, likea mantle of doom.
I offer this viewpoint on a Sunday, the Lord’s Day, for thinking people to ponder on.
“This is why countries with no death penalty have lower murder rates. Our murders escalated since the Chadee Nine were executed in one weekend of 1999”. Linda
Linda that is a poor assessment indicative of a grade 5 student. Murder escalated after Manning made a deal with Abu to kidnap Indians. He then align himself with black intellectuals who adopted American ghetto practices of calling criminals “community leaders”. Further to all of that he fail to provide equipment to locate cell phone calls so that criminals can be tracked. Manning even went into a deal with the criminals prior to elections to lower murder rate so that the PNM will come back to power. He made the deal in one of fancy hotels. The problem with you Linda is that you are wearing a black cloth that is covering your vision. Please stop insulting the intelligence of the learned on this board.
A truly civil society would not kill anyone. In fact I think what it creates is a culture of death and tempting the boundaries of death. Therefore those who commit murder then become special in the world of bandits. It is like wearing a crown.
Murder should be made into a shameful act. But let us look at what is done, ” Society says it is wrong to kill so if you do, we are going to kill you for doing it!” do you really think this is a good strategy?
Make it a crime of national shame. Life imprisonment. With parole after 30 years. When you dead you done. No more suffering but if you alive and deprived of your freedom is worse than death.
Hang them, its a definite way to deter homicides, but please include kidnappers and people convicted of brutal rapes on the hangman’s list.
Kamla, Warner and the PP are the most proactive Gov’t since Mr Panday’s UNC. God bless you.
PS. The greatest sin is when good men stand by and allow innocent people to be taken advantage of.(manning ,rowley & others,are the worst sinners )